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Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 24-11-2014
This August I hope to be competing in the Manx Newcomers and I have been doing as much as I can to learn the course before I get there. I do not think I can afford to visit before August so I have been relying on onboard footage and then watching footage where Milky Quayle explains the nitty gritty bits which I find helps.
In my mind I have broken the course down into different sections so I am learning each section bit by bit.
I was wondering what other methods competitors use to gain race pace course knowledge .
Keith
RE: Competitor course information - Alfie Noakes - 24-11-2014
Do your own thing and very importantly do not pressurise yourself, you're there to enjoy it and you want to be coming back the year after for more, The first laps are not so much about pace but getting you and your machine comfortable with the task, don't be getting into corners too early and then come out off throttle(all arms and legs as I got told hahaha), don't follow quicker people as distance travelled versus your reaction time will get you into a lot of trouble, note any places you're struggling with and if possible go and sit in the hedge and watch where on the track the quicker people are putting their bikes before, mid and on the exit. Maybe have a look at Brian Reid's TZ250 lap on youtube - the Duke video is the best, easy to watch as it's not a 1000cc missile but tells a lot about corner speed, smoothness and bike placement.
RE: Competitor course information - canamant - 24-11-2014
Although I'd been to the IOM for may years on holiday I never learned my way around the course as a course, just roads between places I wanted to be. Over 22 years I had done precisely 3 laps on a motorbike (one of which was a GN125) before I took off down Bray Hill in 2012. My way of learning the Course was to have a day with an experienced competitor in the van where we broke the course down into chunks where you could ride it as you saw it and then bits where you really had to slow down, and bits where you could ride through flat out even though you couldn't see through it. I never watched on board laps as it all looks flat and featureless to me. Joey Dunlop once said the went from places he liked to places he liked. That is probably as good advice as you'll ever get. Be assured though that it does all come together once you start putting in the laps. It also gets addictive. I was on a real downer in 2014 when I didn't get a ride in the Manx or the Classic Races. Really depressed.
RE: Competitor course information - SPL001 - 25-11-2014
As a 2014 newcomer I spent a lot of time watching the Milky Quayle/ John Barton lap (I could almost recite the whole thing by the middle of August) along with a few other on boards like the vendetta racing stuff, and kamil Nolan's laps.......all on YouTube.
I would strongly recommend you get in touch with the Mike Hailwood Foundation (Jim Hunter) as they run really well organised newcomers weekends. You get lots of laps in cars with people who know what they are doing round the mountain course, some very useful information, Scroot tips, etc and get a few beers with people in the same position as you. The weekend probably cost me £200 including flights and we were lucky enough to get some money back from them when we entered and started (almost covered the weekend costs).
Best of luck.
RE: Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 26-11-2014
Thankyou for the responses , every little bit of information and input helps, I like the Mike Hailwood Foundation training days sounds like a really good idea and some extra extra hours overtime could be well invested there. Its a few years since I have been over to even ride around the course so a refresher/learning weekend would be a great idea.
RE: Competitor course information - Carole - 26-11-2014
(26-11-2014, 10:52 AM)Kursaal Flyer Wrote: Thankyou for the responses , every little bit of information and input helps, I like the Mike Hailwood Foundation training days sounds like a really good idea and some extra extra hours overtime could be well invested there. Its a few years since I have been over to even ride around the course so a refresher/learning weekend would be a great idea.
There probably is no substitution for laps, preferably with the help of a seasoned racer, but Olie found it helpful to "play" the old play station games-the course is fairly accurate with landmarks clearly showing.
I have no idea if they are still available, but they do give you an idea- just don't rely on the speeds you think you can reach!
The advise you've been given is sound, it takes time for most to learn the course (and apparently you never stop learning- don't put yourself under pressure and just enjoy it.
RE: Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 29-11-2014
Carole
I might look into a play station to give me something to do on the dark nights ahead, do you know which TT game Olie used there seems to be at least two . The tourist trophy game . or the TT superbike game both are for PS2
Cheers
Keith
RE: Competitor course information - Carole - 29-11-2014
(29-11-2014, 01:26 PM)Kursaal Flyer Wrote: Carole
I might look into a play station to give me something to do on the dark nights ahead, do you know which TT game Olie used there seems to be at least two . The tourist trophy game . or the TT superbike game both are for PS2
Cheers
Keith
Olie used the TT Superbike game, and also TT Legends.
RE: Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 02-12-2014
(25-11-2014, 03:47 PM)SPL001 Wrote: As a 2014 newcomer I spent a lot of time watching the Milky Quayle/ John Barton lap (I could almost recite the whole thing by the middle of August) along with a few other on boards like the vendetta racing stuff, and kamil Nolan's laps.......all on YouTube.
I would strongly recommend you get in touch with the Mike Hailwood Foundation (Jim Hunter) as they run really well organised newcomers weekends. You get lots of laps in cars with people who know what they are doing round the mountain course, some very useful information, Scroot tips, etc and get a few beers with people in the same position as you. The weekend probably cost me £200 including flights and we were lucky enough to get some money back from them when we entered and started (almost covered the weekend costs).
Best of luck.
I have searched the internet and from what I recieved is the Mike Hailwood Foundation organised via the ACU as that is were my web searches have led me ?
I agree about the Milky Quayle / John Barton lap , I have been watching this and a nice smooth 600 on board lap then working the lines and information together in my head. This all points towards making the Foundation weekend a good idea for endorsing this information , there is no substitute for actually going round the course.
Only nine months to go and i'm buzzing already the thought of sorting everything out and then just getting there and giving it a go.
RE: Competitor course information - Splashdown - 02-12-2014
Kursaal Flyer, you sound just like me 40 years ago. Getting ready to ride the TT course is really exciting isn't it?
My first race there was the 1975 Production TT, though actually, what I was really doing, was getting ready to ride in the Manx that year.
The thought of blasting off down Bray Hill, and the realisation of years of dreaming of doing just that, is incredible. When the time came, it was as though I was locked into a little time capsule, with a "I am not really doing this" feeling about it.
I am sure you will love your involvement, you sound really passionate about it.
I have said to many folk over the years, "you've got to want it so much it almost hurts". I'm afraid that it has hurt me just a few many times!
However, I have raced in 87 races round the TT course, not a record, but it's still plenty. The point is that I am STILL looking forward to riding next year, yes 40 years after my first attempt.
So, I wish you good fortune, I will follow your progress with interest.
If I can be of any help, just ask.
Oh, and by the way, the videos are excellent, we didn't have those in my day. However, nowt beats riding t'course!
RE: Competitor course information - SPL001 - 02-12-2014
KF
Don't think the Mike Hailwood foundation is anything to do with ACU. Try jimhunter@wimanx.net or ring the manx motorcycle club office (refer to their website). I understand they have 50+ interested in the newcomers weekends for next year already!!
I am only 85 races behind splashdown but what he said is spot on. The build up is part of what makes it special.
Cheers
RE: Competitor course information - Superbike - 02-12-2014
Hats off to you splashdown that is a mega impressive record total respect to you.
RE: Competitor course information - Splashdown - 03-12-2014
Well thank you Superbike. Much appreciated, and remarks like yours justify me in buying a new bike for next year.
RE: Competitor course information - Superbike - 04-12-2014
Hey splashdown it's no probs I'm just saying what many are thinking. I'd love to race the Isle of Man funding is my weakness, I race in the pre injection/modern classic, The closest thing to a real road I've raced on is Aberdare park some time back and that was a rush let alone racing the mountain course and for the length of time you have been doing it puts you up there in the legendary status.
RE: Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 04-12-2014
Superbike.
I agree costs can put you off , but then if the desire is strong enough there is a way . A few years ago when this desire got the better of me again, I set up a web page with the intention of finding lots of small sponsors to help me pay for getting to the island, at the end of it as a carrot to entice them in I would raffle my bike and give it to one of them . I actually had a good few sponsors on board and put this idea up on the other site but as well as good I got bad reaction to the idea. The main sort of theme I got back is that there is more satisfaction in getting there by paying for yourself than letting others pay for you. I took this on board and have spent my own hard earned and two years getting everything in place to enter this years Manx Newcomers . Next year is going to cost but I am hoping lots of overtime and a bit of wheeling and dealing I will have it covered.
All this to put a big grin on my face
RE: Competitor course information - alien-d64 - 04-12-2014
If you do decide to give the PlayStation thing a go, you'd be best off with the first of the games
TT SuperBikes by Jester Interactive
It came out in 2005 and has a GSXR1000 K3 on the cover.
The second of the games, TT SuperBikes: Real Road Racing Championship is a bit more of a handful, and you'd most likely spend your time trying to figure out how to simply keep the bike on the road, rather than actually learning the track.
The track itself is accurate enough, in my opinion, to give you a good understanding.
However, it is a game, and as such has a few glitches.
I think that it would be of value to use this game in your learning of the course, because unlike watching an onboard lap, the game actually engages you.
Over the last few years I've set off down Bray Hill, virtually, thousands of times.
I am now able to watch onboard laps, even if the camera is pointed at the riders visor,
and keep track of where I am on the course.
I've seen copies on EBay recently for about ten quid.
After that, all you need is a functioning PS2
If you'd like to know anything more about the game(s), say the word.
And, back in the real world, Best of luck
RE: Competitor course information - Superbike - 04-12-2014
Cheers for your post kursaal flyer very Intresting, really trying to get my act together for next year reduce my short circuit stuff and like you say head down a*s up with work to try catch the dangling carrot of the isle of man in the next two or so years. It's great to hear you've got your self sorted good luck I'll have to keep an eye out for you.
RE: Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 28-12-2014
Things are moving forward , I booked my ticket to get to the Island for the course learning weekend sponsored by the Mike Hailwood foundation , thats got to be a good thing and money well spent and it will give me a chance to meet other riders heading for the Island. ( boy are some of them in for a suprise !)
Got my Christmas DVD , the one recomended from 1993 with the on board footage, I like this there are some very good laps one particular one I do like is the 400 one as this is the same cc machine i will be coming to the Island with myself.
I have also noticed that quite a few road markings are different from the modern on board footage I have been watching . ( the modern markings make it easier to pick up certain points on the circuit )
Also picked up a PS2 and a game but need a memory chip to make it work which is on the way .
RE: Competitor course information - Alfie Noakes - 29-12-2014
Good man, the reward and return on your commitment and courage is waiting for you, there's more reward and fun to be had the year after too ... relax, take it all in, start putting it together and most importantly enjoy it. Best rgds.
RE: Competitor course information - Kursaal Flyer - 01-01-2015
Strange feeling this morning , it might only be another day closer to getting there but it sounds closer !
Now its this year
