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+--- Thread: 2005 and beyond (/showthread.php?tid=2836)
2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 15-06-2004
I've read all the remarks under the "Aftermath" heading, with great interest. To begin with please understand that members of the riders forum watch listen evaluate and expound passionately about the worlds greatest races.(And I still believe that remark is correct).
Anyway let me make it completely clear that at the last two meetings every riding member of the forum expressed doubts about finishing with the 400/125 event.
However we need to become aware of the growing Manx population,and the effect that is having on the way the races are organised.The Manx Government is totally committed to running the races, as the new contract with the MMCC proves.Don't forget that if the races were being created today in the 21st century, they would not stand a prayer of getting off the ground. We must take stock and realise how lucky we are to: (a) still have the races and (b) have a committed group behind the scenes doing their damndest to run races that the spectators, riders and manufacturers want, and all policed and marshalled efficiently and effectively.
Hey don't think you have the No1 bottom licker here, 'cos I can assure you that if you eaves dropped the meetings you would not think that.
It's just a little difficult to tell you the contents of a confidential meeting, but I just want you to know that all the riders on the forum totally understand the need for a varied TT programme, and are indeed always concerned about the way the races are evolving.
From a personal note, disappointed as I am at losing the 400 event it cannot be denied that despite a reasonable entry this year,spares are running out, and even though this class (as "Ago Murphy" tells me)is well supported in mainland racing, everyone knew that its days were numbered at the TT.Also I think the 125's failed to get together and do enough to hold their end up.
With the end of morning practices, it will be increasingly difficult to manage "split practices" in the future, as time is at a premium.
So......anyone got any better ideas, with a view to classes for the future and to give everyone a more varied programme?
Lots more to talk about, some other time perhaps.
It might seem somewhat churlish to suggest that I hope everyone enjoyed it, in the light of yet more and tragic accidents, both on and off the track, but it seems the TT from a spectator point of view was a great success.
Talking to the MGP office today it appears that the Manx entry is up, with an excellent newcomer entry. All very encouraging.
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 15-06-2004
So Nick are you going to be completing in the MGP ?
And have you any news about the 125/400 class
at the MGP for 2005 ? I heard that they were keeping it because they feel they should encourage
newcomers to ride a smaller bike to learn the circuit. Pity it's not compulusary for ones with
less experience ? And everyone should do the MGP
as the first ride around the TT course before
being allowed to go and complete at the TT ??
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
I'm sad that these classes are going. I wonder though what new motorbike licence holders are going to ride,if producers are not making small capacity bikes?
Is the british licence system going to change? Here in germany new bikeres ride bikes that are restricted to max 34 bhp. So you can acctually ride big bikes eg. 1000 cc's restricted to 34 bhp. The only thing is you dont get of the line that easily at traffic lights.....
I would love to see two strokes at the TT in future but the manufacturers are going a different way I'm affraid...
Hans
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
Nick , from a purely spectating viewpoint , i enjoyed the TT as much this year as much as ever , the racing was very good and the off track events well organised and interesting and i see no reason why this trend shouldnt continue in the future years.
Thanks for all your efforts.
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
Firstly, thanks Nick for the informed input and keep up the good work.
My TT "experience" only goes back to 1967, my first visit but the interest started 10 years before that.
We have all seen the changes (evolution?) since when the Senior was 500cc and the Junior 350cc. I even remember the 50s racing and giving a good account of themselves. (Thanks Arthur for the Demo.)
However, it will be sad to lose both the 125s and 400s as clases but maybe a few will continue if the regs will allow, within the other classes.(Bigger overall entries).
What could help the classes and the TT "Festival" as a whole, would be if we could encourage more fans to stay on for the Southern 100 (Steam Packet) races on the Saturday.
Here the 125s gave such a good account of themselves against the 400s. What a shame Gail had such a bad start.
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
It's the same problem in the Gran Prix Scene. Where do you see 125cc and 250cc two strokes on the roads??? My son rides a 125cc Aprilia. Before he was eighteen he was restricted to maximum speed 80 km/h. Ride with 80 km/h on a German motorway - it's terrible!!!! And 400cc ?? Nobody sells 400cc machines in Germany. They are special for Japanese rights. I enjoyed the TT 2004 - good races , good weather , nice people. And the problem is so more not Manx are living on the island so greater the anti TT line. I'm happy that the TT is still living and I'll be there as long I can.
Michael
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
Thanks Nick for your ten pennyworth.......We are indeed lucky to be able to see Road Racing at its best on the worlds most demanding circuit !
When I started coming to the TT there were only three classes the 250, 350 and 500 and they were exciting and, as old photos show, very well attended..
My only recommendation is to have the classes as laid out but could they be run in two legs with a final result taken from agregate finishes..
After all the sidecars have two races !
But what replaces the old 250 and the recent 125/400 ??
We have seen 500/600/700 racing, using ducati M series
and the "bare" honda 600s, suzuki 500/600 and the like..
Could these be raced with "safety" on the TT course, Nick ? They are sold in the EU countries and could be a basic machine on which newcomers could learn and people could identify with them.
I'm serious, after all, the bikes of old did not have such wraparound fairings
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
Interested in the various responses to Nick Jeffries message.
I for one thought the racing this year was excellent (with little or no factory support!)but am disappointed to see the demise of the lightweight TT (125/400 class) along with 250's.
The TT appears to be going solely along the route of production based/road bike based racing with superbikes, 600 and superstock as the only solo classes. Atleast with the old senior classes there was the option for some varied machines - eg R71 raced by Dave MM this year , Steve Linsdals hub centre steered special the voxan, RC30 etc. Correct me if I am wrong but for Superbike all bikes need to be homologated and it is likely that the variety of bikes racing will be greatly reduced - the races will become the sole domain of the big 4 jap road bikes (someone might race a ducati again), 600s can also race in the senior I think.
I hope my reading of the rules is wrong or the organisers have a change of heart and allow some more varied machines to race - I for one dont want to only watch jap 600's & 1000's all week (I know they will always be in the majority)- at least there was the option of some varied bikes in 2004.
The 400/125 demise can be explained in various ways by various people - depending on what rumour you listen to - I for one cant see practice sessions being justified as the main reason - there was no problem this year or previous years with split sessions.
At least they have left the chairs alone!
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
Classes
TT Superbike
Machines complying with World Superbike and/or British Superbike specifications:
Over 750cc up to 1000cc 4 cylinders
Over 750cc up to 1000cc 3 cylinders
Over 800cc up to 1000cc 2 cylinders
TT Superstock
Machines complying with FIM Superstock and/or UEM Stocksport and/or MCRCB Stocksport Specifications:
Over 600cc up to 1000cc 4 cylinders
Over 750cc up to 1000cc 3 cylinders
Over 850cc up to 1200cc 2 cylinders
Supersport Junior TT
Machines complying with FIM Supersport or MCRCB Supersport specifications:
Over 400cc up to 600cc 4 cylinders
Over 600cc up to 750cc 2 cylinders
Senior TT
Any machine eligible for TT Superbike, TT Superstock or Supersport Junior TT.
Sidecar TT
ACU Formula 2 Sidecars
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
Thanks Tel.
Depressing, isn't it?
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 16-06-2004
I recall some years ago that coz of the big
crashes in 1989 ? in the production race that
it proved too dangerous so they scrapped the
1000-1300cc ?? Then they brought them back !
Well I know the improvements of the handling of these machines is better, but still they are getting too fast, 127+mph for goodness sake.
What the hell will the lap times be if they say
resurfaced the Ginger Hall to Ramsey section of
the TT course ?? 132mph ????? I say DON'T do it,
its the best part of the circuit left unchanged
but there is bound to become a time when it'll
happen ??
BRING BACK THE TWO STROKERS, BE PREPARED TO FIGHT.
NEIL TUXWORTH YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOURSELF !
WAIT TIL I SEE HIM !!
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 17-06-2004
Haven't heard anyone mention how good the "parade lap" was this year?
Probably not...but that is all you are getting in addition to the Senior TT next year on the Friday.
To replace proper race bikes (125/250's) with just a jolly around the Mountain Circuit is just a joke as far as I am concerned.
An overall reduction in races from 9 (8) to only 7, plus the fact that 250cc bikes will be abolished from the Junior TT and Senior.
Yet, as far as I am aware, newcomers with little or no roadracing experience will be welcomed to the TT with open arms???
Lunacy!!!
Chas.
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 17-06-2004
This is just a quick short reply to Ian The Biggest TT Fan Huntly,s Suggestion about Running something like the Cb500 or 600 Hornets at the TT. I think everyone will remember my adventures last year on Tim Carringtons Fazer 600 in both production 600 and Senior Races and I might add I didnt finish last and with a fastest lap at over 104mph not bad for a tail end charlie all the best Guys and by the way Nick Cheers for the advice on Ballacry it worked keep up the good work roll on TT 2005 as to what I will Ride we will have to wait and see................
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 17-06-2004
Gail,
I must agree ... MGP will be less demanding on qualification times giving riders a chance to learn the course ... bit of a bu**er for the chairs ... no class.
Couperman
Re: 2005 and beyond130mph - Anonymous - 17-06-2004
Where do we go when the lap record reaches 130+,a crying out for a reduced capacity would be a good bet, so we have on offer 5 600 cc races and the sidecars,maybe we need to keep our 125/250 and 400s ,just in case they change there minds in a year or two,many of us sold our good 400s when the class was dropped last time , and then they brought them back again ,one thing is for sure it will be the smaller teams that have to fill the grid up as the factory entries rarely pass 10 in number .
Perhaps there should be a Forgotten Era race for real racing bikes 125 to 250/251 to 500 and 500 to 750 say and give fans a none road bike race to savour ,not classics say 1975 to 1990 including Rotaries,this sounds better than whats on offer for 2005 and onwards .
Its time to see what the real road race fans want not just bow to the big teams and manufactures wishes ,we want our TT to last forever,lets keep it interesting guys......
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 17-06-2004
Yeah parade lap!!!
Wow what a good idea! Just close the road for one parade lap on the Friday and forget the racing.... more time to party!
Think of the attractions we could have if there was no racing to get in the way of having a 'safe, law abiding' good time!
Re: 2005 and beyond - Anonymous - 18-06-2004
Thank you Chris the pleasure was mine.Pity the little Kreidler did'nt behave itself as it can run much better and faster than that especially if I could loose some weight.It actually seized 400yds from the line.