http://www.manxradio.com/readNEwsItem.aspx?id=12131

the riders dont seem to keen!

I heard Lougher being interviewed and the guy asking the questions was basically telling him it was a good thing. He didn't sound very comfortable to me.

Another thing...on a thread on tt.com it was stated at a 'minuted' meeting that John McG wasn't keen on racing 250s around the Mountain, however on the news section of the site John is stated as having said he would 'love' to ride a 250 on the Mountain again.

If I remember right, the second 600 race was ditched after just one year on 'safety grounds'. I suspect it was more on marketing grounds as two thirds of the entry blew up :wink:

I'm hatching a plan for the perfect TT (alright, MY perfect TT... ), so maybe this will be a stop-gap until something more interesting comes along!

It strikes me that this "solution" to the clamour for the return of 2-strokes
is a hastily cobbled sop and nothing more.
I cant see it happening actually (no, I won eat my hat!)

For me (and obviously most riders) the TT is the mountain (yes, I know about the Clypse) and Bilown is Bilown.
But you CAN have a very good post TT meeting as has been proved.
You cant have a TT at Billown!
"We" wan to hear 2-stokes going down Bray and we want to hear them through the tress, at speed.
But, hey, what do I know?

What do others think?

I totally agree Mike.When I listened to the radio interview with John MsGuinness, he was non too keen, and William Dunlop certainly isn't.Any true TT mountain course rider will not accept that they have won a TT if they win over the Billown course.How many laps will it be run over in order to make a realistic TT distance? 32? :roll: The S100 club are brilliant organisers and are well capable of putting on a super show, but it should be a post TT high profile event, NOT a TT.I also think that a second 600 TT race is a step backwards as spectators are sick of the sameness of machinery.Of course, competitors who run them may be happy as it gives them more opportunity for using them.I may be completely wrong, but why can't a classic race be fitted in as so many visitors from other countries would thoroughly enjoy that,especially those who are not able to holiday at the MGP.

For those that want to see a 250TT and a 125 TT then this has to be better than nothing.

However I have today discovered that the price to pay for this is the loss of the 125/400 Steam Packet race. In fact 400s are excluded completely from the Steam Packet races.............Southern 100 next? Manx GP ?

I realise that 400s are getting old now and that perhap their time is coming but to specficially excluded them is I feel a step too far they will die a natural death in time

So I ask myself what is the overall gain here...................or more importantly who will gain


I just wonder how many local (IOM) Manx GP competitors will miss out on a meeting vital to them getting the dreaded course licence.

Seems to me that once again the rich and powerful are the winners while once again the ordinary club national racer losses out.
It was ever so.

I hope they enjoy their faux TT ...........sadly I can't go now

My concern for the 2 stroke races is that if they are not well supported it will just give the organisers the ammunition to say they have no further future. So, I hope everyone, riders, fans, media etc get behind this and hopefully it will serve as a catalyst to get these bikes back on the Mountain where they belong.

Oh, dont get me wrong.

I will be there, in Castletown (Steam Racket permitting of course!)
to support the new races.
I just feel very strongly that they should NOT be TT races.

It was a good job I didnt offer to munch my hat as it seems that
riders ar interested after all!

Hi Mike

This is not a 'hastily cobbled together sop'. In fact initial discussions started around eight months ago, followed by consultation with riders. We would have been shocked if there was no debate about the races at Billown, however we are committed to making them a massive success, and we will ensure that both races field the best entry in two stroke racing in the UK and Ireland in 2008 by some distance.

This could lead to development of the class, and you never know, it might lead to the classes finding their way back to the Mountain Circuit, if rider interest increases.

As for Classic Racing Hilary, that is already catered for at the Manx Grand Prix as you know, and bringing Classic Racing to the TT would almost certainly have a detrimental effect on the Grand Prix. It would also present difficulties incorporating them into the practice schedule.

Cargo, as far as I know there are no plans to loose the 400's from either the Southern 100 or Manx Grand Prix, in fact I believe the aspiration is to build upon this popular club level class at these meetings.

Best wishes

Paul

Paul Phillips Wrote:This could lead to development of the class, and you never know, it might lead to the classes finding their way back to the Mountain Circuit, if rider interest increases.


Best wishes

Paul

This encouraging statement from Paul is EXACTLY why we shouldn't be arguing about wether it'll be a proper TT or not and just get behind the thing. There's a golden opportunity here to get proper race bikes back on the Mountain, so let's all try and be positive about it and make it work. Especially if some of the guys who haven't ridden 250s much lately get to remember how much fun they are to race :wink:

sticky Wrote:Especially if some of the guys who haven't ridden 250s much lately get to remember how much fun they are to race :wink:

Exactly!

Paul

Paul,

may I start by saying thank you for taking the trouble to reply to our coments.
One of the really good things about the latest TT setup is that you guys DO
listen to the comments of the fans as wel as the riders(who of course SHOULD
have the last word. It also speaks volumes about the status of this website
that we can have free and open discussions on any sensible topic to do with
our great event. I strongly believe that there is a good bunch of valuable
opinions in here. All credit to Malcolm, Helen and Cargo.

Back to your thoughts on the new races.
I dont want to appear positive, really.
More power to your elbow.
If we get to see more "proper" racing bikes, fantastic.
No, my main point was more about the value and cudos of a "real" TT win.
To exagerate to prove a point.
If somebody gets to 26 TT wins including Bilown races, will that make them
as good as Joey? Of course not.
I think the same would apply to anyone who has one ONE TT over the Mountain
course as to a Bilown TT winner.

What do others think?

Joey might have had an opinion on this as he was the most successful rider there, and had a few mishaps too. He held the Billown course in very high regard. I think he would have said it was just as challenging, just different.
I think if someone has a mixture of wins, different capacities and now different courses, that would say they were an even greater champion.

I am quite prepared to lose the odd argument, as long
as along the way, we get healthy debate!
Who better to concede to?

OK let me throw my hat in the ring on this one. I am delighted that there is such enthusiasm and debate, which in itself is good for the TT. I am in support of new ideas to generate interest in what we know to be the best race in the world, HELD ON THE BEST RACE TRACK. I can see where the organisers are coming from in trying to appease those that want variety in the 2 week festival (me included), but the wrong thing to do is to call a race round a 4 mile course a "TT win". It clearly is not.
One of the reasons for the demise of the Clypse Course was that the riders did not feel that they had won a "real" TT. Just ask Carlo Ubbiali, Cecil Sandford, Luigi Taveri,Tommy Robb, Sammy Miller, and other riders of the time. In addition marshalling and road closures complicated the organisation. Plus ca change!!
And their feeling of not winning a TT was with a 10.79 mile course, AND it used part of the TT course!
No I'm sorry, I can't get my head round the TT win side of this, but I think it's a great idea to run races round the Southern Course to maintain the interest in 250's,and 125's, and spread the entertainment throughout the festival. I don't see the need to call it a TT win, especially when it is so contentious. Why not just run some additional races on the Southern course, and give them a new name, maybe something like the Southern TT Championship? Suggestions.

Hi Nick and thanks for those comments.
It seems that you and I are on the same wavelength (why am I not suprised?)
The huge difference between us is that you ARE a TT winner and have
far more right to comment than I do.
I feel that that your suggestion of Southern TT championship is a good one. That or something very similar will do very nicely.
They should not be TT races perse.

I do have one other point that I believe we should discuss.
Because I had to get my ferry back, I could not take in the Steam Packet races (THis having missed the classic races at the start of the festival because of..... you guessed..... Steam Packet sailing changes...)
However, I understand from those who did that there were huge crowds and viewing was limited (not to mention the fact that sme people got into places where they shouldnt) which spoiled it for some.
Now I know we shouldnt expect such enourmous crowds as this, the Centenary TT year, but I woud hope that if the lineup is as good as Paul is working towards, it will still be busy.
My concern is that viewing points are good enough to cope.
Am I right to be concerned about this?

This year was really exceptional, as there were many many people who had the opposite problem to yourselves and were unable to get home for a few days after the TT.
I particularly noticed that many of the extra people were from Eastern Europe and the more far-flung bits of our neighbouring islands.
I don't think the same will happen in 2008. What causes it to be a wee bit more difficult (apart from only 4 and a bit miles, and much of that inaccessible to spectators) is the fact much of the viewing area is flat, so if someone is at the front, no-one else can see. If it ever became becessary I am sure there is potential for more grandstands at several points.
Most of the problem was in the pits/paddock area, and if people were more familiar with Billown, they would move out of there.
The people who were in unsafe places chose to go there. There was no need, and they are completely responsible for their own vulnerability in that instance. No sympathy.
While a bit of me selfishly wanted these all extra people to go home and let me see (!!), I would encourage everyone who possibly can to come early for the Pre-TT CLassic, and stay late for the Steam Packet / Southern TT Races.

Billown is best slightly biased witch

Sounds like the predictable start of the ACU trying to suck in every conceivable point of interest to get the spectators and profits in to the "TT Festival" without the hassle of having to run more races on the mountain circuit, in so doing pulling riders and resources away from other events.