"What is special about this machine"?

(03-05-2011, 07:51 PM)Malcolm Wrote:

"What is special about this machine"?

What is the bike ?

Who is the rider ?

What race was he in ?

What year was this taken ?

Where did he finish in the race ?

I'm guessing Tom Phillis. Norton Domiracer, Doug Hele, forground, right hand side

(03-05-2011, 09:02 PM)pat slinn Wrote:

(03-05-2011, 07:51 PM)Malcolm Wrote:

"What is special about this machine"?

What is the bike ?

Who is the rider ?

What race was he in ?

What year was this taken ?

Where did he finish in the race ?

I'm guessing Tom Phillis. Norton Domiracer, Doug Hele, forground, right hand side

Just so, Pat - 1961 Senior TT.

3rd at 98.78mph with a lap at over 100 - the first 100 mph lap by a twin and by a pushrod engine.

(03-05-2011, 09:33 PM)larryd Wrote:

(03-05-2011, 09:02 PM)pat slinn Wrote:

(03-05-2011, 07:51 PM)Malcolm Wrote:

"What is special about this machine"?

What is the bike ?

Who is the rider ?

What race was he in ?

What year was this taken ?

Where did he finish in the race ?

I'm guessing Tom Phillis. Norton Domiracer, Doug Hele, forground, right hand side

Just so, Pat - 1961 Senior TT.

3rd at 98.78mph with a lap at over 100 - the first 100 mph lap by a twin and by a pushrod engine.

I agree with all the above, I seem to remember the UK M/C Press was very excited over the result of the Norton, I can't remember what happened to the bike after this. Did Norton start to loose interest in racing, or did they then go out of business?

Yes you are correct:

It is of course the Australian rider Tom Phillis who raced a developed 500cc Domiracer in the 1961 Senior TT and scored a very creditable third place behind Mike Hailwood and Bob Mclntyre who were both on Manx Nortons after the MV Agusta of Gary Hocking had dropped out.

Bearing in mind that this was the first outing for the twin in major competition it was a very fine start and even recorded a lap of 100.3 m.p.h.

Those were the days when the TT really meant something and the 100 mph lap was no mean feat.

(03-05-2011, 11:21 PM)chris Wrote:

(03-05-2011, 09:33 PM)larryd Wrote:

(03-05-2011, 09:02 PM)pat slinn Wrote:

(03-05-2011, 07:51 PM)Malcolm Wrote:

"What is special about this machine"?

What is the bike ?

Who is the rider ?

What race was he in ?

What year was this taken ?

Where did he finish in the race ?

I'm guessing Tom Phillis. Norton Domiracer, Doug Hele, forground, right hand side

Just so, Pat - 1961 Senior TT.

3rd at 98.78mph with a lap at over 100 - the first 100 mph lap by a twin and by a pushrod engine.

I agree with all the above, I seem to remember the UK M/C Press was very excited over the result of the Norton, I can't remember what happened to the bike after this. Did Norton start to loose interest in racing, or did they then go out of business?

Not long after I think that Doug left Norton for Triumph and there was nobody at Bracebridge st to continue the development ?, Anybody recognize the person to the right of Doug Hele ?, it looks a bit like Clive Bennett from Ariel .

Yep thats clive Bennett and Dennis Green in overalls, Norton did not close down bur moved to Plumstead as part of assiciated Motoor Cycles, AJS Matcless, only one employee John Hudson a technical writer went to work ther, so kapput to the old real Bracebridge street Norton.

There are a lot of stories about where the bike reallywent to all of them false , but it lay in the race shop for a long tiime, there was a batch of similasr domiracers about six if I rember but they did not have the same motor, similar yes.

Most of the work on Tom's motor was done by Dennis Poulton a backroom genius who always kept a very low profile, he is one of the few from thos days still alive and lives in Great barr, Birmingham.

The actual special motor from that bie, well only one man Arther Stocker from Brierly Hill new were it went and a few others. That motor was blown to bits at the Manx or Darley Moore and there were none of the trick bits especially for the cylinder head that dennis had made, so it was scrapped.

Under Allan Sugar the boss of AMC the race shop was wound down a production or the Mannx Norton ceased , Funny how stories get mixed up and turn to fantasy, I read on another forum about how some guy met this lovely blue eyed blond , dated her and went to her hom and she turned out to be the daughter of Tom Loughridge, well my late wife and I never had any children.

Sadly Tom Phillis got killed on a 350 works Honda 4 in the Glen Helen area at the TT

Meemory is drifting back, Dennis Greenfield and Fed Swift took the ike to the UGP, not sure if Tom was riding it but it was damaged and never repaired then the motor was " tealeafed". the six other bikes that had been buillt for Daytona all had the lowboy frames, but when the original motor was blown it was not in a lowboy frame it was either a standard Manx or 650SS frame with all Manx kit on it.

Paul Dunstall bought all of the Daytona bikes and spares a developed a tidy busimess with the Dunstall Domiracers.

Dennis Greenfield and Fred Swift were experimental teters amonst other things , not racer, but with Denniis Poultons help they developed a very quick 650SS from a test bike reg number was203 DOC, took it to THruxton and won the 400 miler production race first time out that bike had the first six start oill punp rather than a three start on the twins, and was later standard on the first 750 Atlas bikes, that was another of Dennis Poultons brainwaves I bought that bike and had it for a good few years and it was very quick and easily equal or better tha a Bonneville.

Great days at that time a gang of us used to keep our bkes at a massive coach house owned by Pat Walsh in Edgbaston, Albert Noule,kept gis bikes there as did myself and Bob Heath when we started racing, Clive Elliott Ken Sparayson and a few others hung out there and Clive did a coouple of Ariel Arrows for Albet and Pat to use in the TT.

Guess those of you who know me Larry and Cargo are wondering how I can post now I am blind, amazing the trck kit they came up at Coleraine University took me a while but , getting there apart from a few typos.

The last owner of the REAL motor was killed in a road accident on a CX500 about 25 years ago I went to his funeral in the black country with Bob Heath and Tony Rutter.

Guess those of you who know me Larry and Cargo are wondering how I can post now I am blind, amazing the trck kit they came up at Coleraine University took me a while but , getting there apart from a few typos.

Welcome back Tom - delighted your eye is working again!!!

You'll now go back on our "circular robin" !!!

The Domiracer came to the Ulster in '61 as you said - Roy Ingram rode it, dropped it at Quarry and, sadly, the bike fatally injured a flagman.

Cheers

Larry

Yes your right Larry I know a msrshal was killed because there was a lot of very depressed faces when the bike came back, just was not sure who had ridden it, it was just dumped in a corner and left there for ages until the mice arrived.

The remaing eye still does not work and as blind as a bat just got taight how to use a pc and a pit of kit.

Got a cracking nurse who comes and polishhes up the other one, very gentle got a touch like a butterflies wing.

Its so good to have you back on this website. I hope you are well and managing.

Take care.

Ian TTFan Huntly

(08-05-2011, 06:48 PM)ian huntly Wrote: Its so good to have you back on this website. I hope you are well and managing.

Take care.

Ian TTFan Huntly

---

mr loughridge,what a wonderfull and very interesting story.I got the answer to the original question,this was my favourite period ,but your contribution was a first class read,this gives us enthusiasts some wonderfull behind the picture thoughts and really does keep the past alive.Thank you.

Did the Administrator for this site really state in an earlier posting:
"Those were the days when the TT really meant something........"
Forgive me, hasn't the TT recovered its standing over the last few years? I think it's an insult to the likes of Ian Hutchinson and co. to make this sort of statement.
I do know what he is really meaning to say, but hang on a minute, we could do with something more positive from Admin.
No we know how little Admin think of the TT, we can understand the apathy amongst forum members.

You beat me to it Nick, I ws going to post a similar reply along the lines of 'Hang on a minute it still does really mean something!!'

Yes I did make the statement "Those were the days when the TT really meant something and the 100 mph lap was no mean feat", and this was meant to reflect the fact that the TT had not been perceived in the same way, in the eyes of the greater worldwide audience over the years, primarily since its exclusion from the World Championship.

I have never intentionally made any derogatory statement or intended slur against any participant of the TT and never would do as in my opinion anyone who puts his (or her) backside on a bike and takes it down Bray Hill on the stop is without doubt someone to be admired. This includes all past and certainly the present participants who do so at speeds possibly never envisaged as being attained by any of the past participants.

I have supported the TT for many years and I continue to do so, one being the continuing hosting of this site for the public, whether they appreciate it or not.

I take offence to your comment that "No we know how little Admin think of the TT, we can understand the apathy amongst forum members.. You do not know me, you have never met me and you do not know what I think of the TT, never mind what I have done over the years relative to my support of motorcycle racing.

In addition, I comment that the apathy amongst forum members as you put it, is also clearly visible on other websites that are there for the support of motorcycle racing.

Take a look at the official TT site, take a look at some of the others and tell me that they are as popular now as they were 12 months or so back.

No they are not and why, simple really, the appearance growth and expansion of the Social Networking sites that now exist, which allow each individual to have their own little area of the world wide web that they can control and add to with whatever they like at any time, inviting to or being invited by like minded persons who also have their own little piece of the World wide web at their fingertips.

It is comments such as yours that make me feel that I waste my time by continuing with this site and that I should be better off simply using my time being employed doing something that gives me pleasure rather than earache.

Malcolm

Interesting how different people have different concepts of what that the TT is all about, things change over various decades, and to mamy the TT today would be comlete;y alien to those who knew it and experienced in in the 50s/70s.

Gone are the days when it was a family affair and the Liverpool doocks wre heaving and buzzing with people from all walks of life and financial means. Men in trilby hats and gaberdine macs humping the suitcases with the wife and kids in tow heading for their favourite barding house for the annual holiday, I an will rember, all inter mingling together with motor cycle enthusiasts on evering from Bantam to Vincents.

Bikes crammed footrest to footrest from the docks In Douglas along the fron to Onchan and ever back street, rider of every ability in garages were peoplecoould stand and watch riders doing there own spanneriing even the stars of the day, an amazing ecperience of equals, so diiferent to today with the stars with there £1m motor homes hidden away in a paddock that no one can get bear, the new concept of merchandising everything, if it ain't making money don't do it.

Sure these stars of today on the incredible machinery that is produced, and far beyond the dreams of riders of the past and their financial capability to own. No longer part of the continental circus armosphere, it elimanates all but the very rich or with a lot of sposorship from participating. However that is progess for better of worse.

I am the opinion that the spectators get poor value for money, such short races, only 60 starters instead of 120 plus resrves lack of variety and isolation from riders and bikes to really get the flavour of what the TT is all abouut and it original concept, now it is dictated by money and mmanufacturer film rights etc. possibibly a total change of mentality of what wets the appetite, one thing for certain is that every rider who I have spoken from the 50s/70s, in united in the same opinion without exception "we had the best years".

No one could ever decry the outstanding ability of todays riders on the missiles they are riding today.

Times change sometimes for the better sometimes not it is a matter opinion.

I am most grateful to all those have messaged me a visited me since the loss of my sight and wife partivlarly Jan from Oz who came last September. Life goes on and we adapt to changes or walk away.

An excellent and honest reply,spoken from the heart and echo,s my thoughts ,feelings and good memories.Takes nothing away from todays competitors,I hold them in the same vein as yesterdays heroes,theyr,e all heroes in my eyes.But,like everything in today,s modern world,the merchandising and financial aspect has taken over,and that certain charming atmosphere has gone. However,i,m going back once again to cheer the latest generation on ,it will never leave the system,and i hope to get excited once again.In fact,i know i will,and i look forward to seeing splashdo,sorry Nick J and all.plus Murray walker.That should bring back the Stanley Schofield records to mind.Ride safe all and enjoy yourselves.

(13-05-2011, 12:51 PM)Tom Loughridge Wrote: Interesting how different people have different concepts of what that the TT is all about, things change over various decades, and to mamy the TT today would be comlete;y alien to those who knew it and experienced in in the 50s/70s.

Gone are the days when it was a family affair and the Liverpool doocks wre heaving and buzzing with people from all walks of life and financial means. Men in trilby hats and gaberdine macs humping the suitcases with the wife and kids in tow heading for their favourite barding house for the annual holiday, I an will rember, all inter mingling together with motor cycle enthusiasts on evering from Bantam to Vincents.

Bikes crammed footrest to footrest from the docks In Douglas along the fron to Onchan and ever back street, rider of every ability in garages were peoplecoould stand and watch riders doing there own spanneriing even the stars of the day, an amazing ecperience of equals, so diiferent to today with the stars with there £1m motor homes hidden away in a paddock that no one can get bear, the new concept of merchandising everything, if it ain't making money don't do it.

Sure these stars of today on the incredible machinery that is produced, and far beyond the dreams of riders of the past and their financial capability to own. No longer part of the continental circus armosphere, it elimanates all but the very rich or with a lot of sposorship from participating. However that is progess for better of worse.

I am the opinion that the spectators get poor value for money, such short races, only 60 starters instead of 120 plus resrves lack of variety and isolation from riders and bikes to really get the flavour of what the TT is all abouut and it original concept, now it is dictated by money and mmanufacturer film rights etc. possibibly a total change of mentality of what wets the appetite, one thing for certain is that every rider who I have spoken from the 50s/70s, in united in the same opinion without exception "we had the best years".

No one could ever decry the outstanding ability of todays riders on the missiles they are riding today.

Times change sometimes for the better sometimes not it is a matter opinion.

I am most grateful to all those have messaged me a visited me since the loss of my sight and wife partivlarly Jan from Oz who came last September. Life goes on and we adapt to changes or walk away.

You words paint a wonderful picture Tom.

Thanks.

My thoughts exactly...

The TT is still my main interest in life but I have witnessed the ups and downs when the event was stagnating, Then things happened to bring it back up.

I agree it is not the family event it was, but in those days we all stayed in the Victorian hotels along Douglas Bay front, went about in coaches and this compacted everyone as a group. I suppose the camp sites have now become the social centres but many others go into homestays as singles or pairs.

I look at my photos from the 50s and see crowds 2 or 3 deep at many vantage spots. A lot of these viewing areas are now closed off and or have houses and ploughed areas where public are not allowed.

I'm sorry that Malcolm feels he has to apologise for a fact he has stated in good faith.

Perhaps we "Oldies" are guilty of remembering the TT through rose-tinted brain cells but we can actually remember some great times and very significant milestones in the history of the TT.......and I hope I continue to remember them.

I identify with the "Continental Circus" atmosphere, it seemed to put everyone on the same level. Trouble was, everyone rode similar British machines..(!)

So what's changed...They are Japanese bikes now...

I love the whole TT event, there have been many changes over the years, some better than others, but I think most of us have contracted the TT Bug and don't want to lose it. I am still thinking positive.....

Not long now.......Time this site was buzzing...Come on put your thoughts onto your PC and fire them to ttwebsite.com

This is Tom Phillis on the domiracer at the 1961 IOM TT. near right is Doug Hele,
near left I think Dennis Greenfield and myself hidden behind Doug. This was probably a
practice session with the MK1 engine on board as the MK2 was fitted quite late in the
proceedings.
The MK2 had quite a few mods with a different crankshaft, valve gear, cylinder head/
valves and pistons among other things. The rockers were free of adjusters, the valve clearances
adjusted with eccentric rocker spindles. the rockers were made from four blocks that Harry Salter, a
fantastic machinist, had machined the wiper pad, spindle bore and ball end. I was left with
the job of filing and polishing the rest away by hand. This took four weeks! one of the reasons
there was only one MK2 engine made to my knowledge.
The crank shaft cracked about one and a half laps from the finish of the Senior. Tom said he felt the difference
and nursed it to the finish. What a rider and one of the nicest people I've known. We didn't know this
till I stripped it back at Bracebridge Street.
Dennis, Doug and myself took it next to the Ulster GP. Tom rode it again but hit a machine that had
crashed on the first lap (I think)
I don't know what happened to the machine after as I joined Doug Hele (who I owe so much to)
at Triumph